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David Robertson on Conducting, Pierre Boulez, and Musical Interpretation (Ep.248)

Why musical leadership demands a tolerance for looking ridiculous

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On the Conversations with Tyler podcast, esteemed economist Tyler Cowen engages with today’s most underrated thinkers in wide-ranging explorations of their work, the world, and everything in between.

 

Musings

In the 2024-25 season, David Robertson performs works by Pierre Boulez with the Juilliard Orchestra, New York Philharmonic, at the Aspen Music Festival and School, and Lucerne Festival, in celebration of Boulez 100.  He wrote this essay in conjunction with the Aspen performances.

 

As Music Director of the Ensemble Intercontemporain (EIC) in Paris from 1991 until 2000 I often had the rare privilege to sit next to Pierre Boulez, the founder and President of the group, on the airplane when the EIC was on tour. I’ve always admired how Boulez maintained such varied occupations, juggling simultaneously the roles of composer, conductor, educator, writer, and administrator.  One time I gave into curiosity and asked how he defined himself with all these different activities. “Pierre, what do you put down on the arrival card under Profession?” He replied quite simply: “I just put down Musician…”

News & Applause

JANUARY 25, 2025: the New York Philharmonic marks the centennial of former Music Director Pierre Boulez by remounting one of his legendary ‘Rug Concerts’. Originally performed in 1974, the concert explores connections among works by composers ranging from J.S. Bach and Schubert to Boulez himself.  Part of the NY Phil’s Sounds On.

PIERRE BOULEZ
The Magus, by Alex Ross, The New Yorker
January 18, 2016

Musings

Whorl, n. – Each of the turns, coils, or convolutions in any spiral structure and

Eddy, n. – A circular motion in water, or air, contrary to the current.

As someone who spent a decade attempting to tame the tricky winds that flow from mouthpiece to bell, I have a deep love of the horn and enormous admiration for those who can master its treacherous physics.  The thoughts swirling in my head as I wrote for Andrew Bain were largely connected to the beauty of his sound and the purity of his tone in all registers.

Whorls and Eddies
By David Robertson
Commissioned by LA Phil, with generous support from the Lenore S. and Bernard A. Greenberg Fund

World Premiere by LA Phil New Music Group / Green Umbrella
LA Phil Etudes: Book 1
Conducted by John Adams
April 16, 2024
Walt Disney Concert Hall

News & Applause

“It’s always a good sign when an orchestra’s players light up with smiles at a conductor. And on Thursday night at David Geffen Hall, that happened over and over, with grins passing between the musicians of the New York Philharmonic and its podium guest, David Robertson, throughout a beguiling, smart program.”

Anastasia Tsioulcas, The New York Times – Critic’s Pick
On David Robertson and the New York Philharmonic
October 20, 2023

Musings

Le temps et l’écume was premiered on December 11, 1989, at the Maison de Radio France by the Nouvel Orchestre Philharmonique de Radio France, conducted by the American David Robertson. It was Robertson’s first in-depth engagement with spectral music. “I remember thinking, OK, this is complex stuff, let me go to the piano and play it,” he said. “There were thirteen notes in the first chord that starts the piece off, and I could only play three of them on an equally tempered piano. That left me feeling quite daunted.” Robertson had to accept that he would not be able to hear the music in his head before he gave the first downbeat. But he rehearsed with Grisey, whom he found “very calm, but very exacting,” and the premiere was a success. The concert was long and had too many new works, Robertson recalled, but the audience could tell that Le temps et l’écume “was a serious piece in the repertoire.”

Delirium and Form: The Life and Music of Gérard Grisey
By Jeffrey Arlo Brown

Boydell & Brewer, University of Rochester Press
August 8, 2023
318 Pages

Available from Boydell & Brewer, and other booksellers

News & Applause

Three-Year Tenure Begins in 2023-24 Season

Salt Lake City, December 7, 2022— David Robertson—a distinguished and renowned American conductor, composer, thinker, artist, and visionary—will join Utah Symphony | Utah Opera’s artistic leadership team in the newly-created role of Creative Partner for a three-year tenure beginning in the 2023-24 season. The symphony’s international search for its next Music Director is ongoing and Robertson looks forward to a close collaboration with that position… [read the full announcement]

News & Applause

A GLIMPSE OF THE BUTTERFLY

“The great joy is when you feel you’ve found the right key that unlocks things only that orchestra can do… Who knows what will come? That’s the nature of living with the unknown in front of us, as Boulez liked to say.”

 

An interview with composer and conductor David Robertson

VAN MAGAZINE
By Jeffrey Arlo Brown
November 10, 2022

Recordings

Musings

  1. “…la musique incertaine de leur voix…”
  2. Anfore del cuore
  3. Rounding to Joy

Written for and dedicated to Orli Shaham. Commissioned by the Orlando Philharmonic Orchestra, Eric Jacobsen, Music Director, 2022.

World premiere performances, October 15 – 16, 2022
Orlando Philharmonic Orchestra
Eric Jacobsen, conductor
Orli Shaham, piano
Dr. Phillips Center – Steinmetz Hall
Orlando, FL

Upcoming

October 16-19, 2025

Leipzig, Germany

Leipzig Gewandhausorchester

Leipzig Gewandhaus

Kirill Gerstein, piano

  • Stravinsky

  • Concerto for Piano and Winds

  • Ravel

  • Concerto for the Left Hand

  • Arvo Pärt

  • Nekrolog

  • Bernstein

  • Symphonic Dances from West Side Story

October 24-25, 2025

Salt Lake City, UT

Utah Symphony

Abravanel Hall

Timothy McAllister, saxophone

  • Boulez

  • Memoriale

  • Steven Mackey

  • Anemology (Saxophone Concerto)

  • Rachmaninoff

  • Symphony No. 1

November 13-16, 2025

New York

New York Philharmonic

David Geffen Hall

Nicola Benedetti, violin

  • Caroline Mallonee

  • Lakeside Game

  • Wynton Marsalis

  • Violin Concerto

  • Stravinsky

  • Petrushka (1911, original version)

December 2-6, 2025

Budapest, Hungary

Budapest Festival Orchestra

Müpa, Budapest
House of Arts, Albertirsa

Xavier de Maistre, harp

  • Ligeti

  • Mifiso la sodo

  • Ginastera

  • Harp Concerto

  • Nielsen

  • Symphony No. 4, “The Inexstinguishable”

December 12, 2025

Frankfurt, Germany

HR-Sinfonieorchester

Alte Oper

Lucas and Arthur Jussen, piano

  • John Adams

  • The Chairman Dances

  • Bartók

  • Concerto for Two Pianos, Percussion and Orchestra

  • John Adams

  • Harmonielehre

January 30-31, 2026

Vancouver, BC

Vancouver Symphony Orchestra

The Orpheum

Orli Shaham, piano

  • Alex Robertson

  • Modum

  • John Adams

  • Must the Devil Have All the Good Tunes?

  • Nielsen

  • Symphony No. 4, “The Inextinguishable”

February 11, 2026

New York

The Juilliard Orchestra

Carnegie Hall

  • Varèse

  • Amériques

  • Schoenberg

  • Five Pieces for Orchestra, Op. 16 (original)

  • Stravinsky

  • The Rite of Spring

February 20-21, 2026

Salt Lake City, UT

Utah Symphony

Abravanel Hall

Madeline Adkins, violin

  • Rouse

  • Rapture

  • John Adams

  • Violin Concerto

  • Carter

  • Holiday Overture

  • Harris

  • Symphony No. 3

February 26-28, 2026

Washington, DC

National Symphony Orchestra

The Kennedy Center

Orli Shaham, piano
Gil Shaham, violin

  • Nielsen

  • Helios Overture

  • Reena Esmail

  • Double Concerto for Violin and Piano

  • Sibelius

  • Symphony No. 5

March 6-7, 2026

St. Louis, MO

St. Louis Symphony Orchestra

American Reflections

Powell Hall

Orli Shaham, piano

  • Steven Mackey

  • Turn the Key

  • David Robertson

  • Light forming – a piano concerto

  • Sarah Kirkland Snider

  • Something for the Dark

  • Bernstein

  • Symphony No. 2, “The Age of Anxiety”

About

Conductor David Robertson

David Robertson – conductor, composer, artist, thinker, and American musical visionary – occupies some of the most prominent platforms on the international music scene.  A highly sought-after podium figure in the worlds of opera, orchestral music, and new music, Robertson is celebrated worldwide as a champion of contemporary composers, an ingenious and adventurous programmer, and a masterful communicator whose passionate advocacy for the art form is widely recognized.  A consummate and deeply collaborative musician, Robertson is hailed for his intensely committed music making.

In the 2025-26 season, David Robertson deepens his commitment to inspiring the world’s greatest orchestras and the next generation of musical artists.  He will return to conduct the St. Louis Symphony Orchestra for the first time since the culmination of his tenure as music director.  In St. Louis’s newly renovated Powell Hall (March 6-7, 2026), he will lead Leonard Bernstein’s Symphony No. 2, “The Age of Anxiety”; the first SLSO performances of Sarah Kirkland Snider’s Something for the Dark and his own composition Light forming – a piano concerto with Orli Shaham; and Steven Mackey’s Turn the Key.  Robertson will make his second post-chief conductorship visit to the Sydney Symphony Orchestra, (Sydney Opera House, July 3-5, 2026), leading the SSO in performances of Nielsen’s Symphony No. 4, “The Inextinguishable”, and the Beethoven Violin Concerto with Gil Shaham.  2025-26 is David Robertson’s eighth academic year as Director of Conducting Studies, Distinguished Visiting Faculty of The Juilliard School in New York, as he continues his role as a member of the Tianjin Juilliard Advisory Council, an international body created to guide Juilliard’s Chinese campus.  He conducts the Juilliard Orchestra at Carnegie Hall on February 11, 2026.

David Robertson will return to the New York Philharmonic (November 13-16) to lead the world premiere of Caroline Mallonee’s Lakeside Game, co-commissioned as part of the orchestra’s Project 19; Wynton Marsalis’s Violin Concerto with Nicola Benedetti; and Stravinsky’s Petrushka (1911).  Robertson conducts a number of other North American orchestras throughout the season, including the Dallas Symphony Orchestra (September 12-14) with Emanuel Ax, Nashville Symphony (September 19-21) with Orli Shaham performing Robertson’s Light forming, the National Symphony in Washington, DC (February 26-28) with Orli Shaham and Gil Shaham performing the world premiere of Reena Esmail’s Double Concerto (to be reprised at the Aspen Music Festival and School), and the Vancouver Symphony (January 30-31) performing works by John Adams and Nielsen and Alex Robertson’s Modum.  He will conclude his three-year tenure as Creative Partner of the Utah Symphony with three visits in October, February and May, with a wide range of music and guest artists.

In Europe, Robertson returns to the Leipzig Gewandhausorchester (October 16-19) with Kirill Gerstein performing Stravinsky’s Concerto for Piano and Winds and Ravel’s Concerto for the Left Hand with works by Arvo Pärt and Bernstein.  With the Budapest Festival Orchestra and guest artist harpist Xavier de Maistre, he conducts works by Ligeti, Ginastera and Nielsen (December 2-6), and works by John Adams and Bartók with the HR-Sinfonieorchester at the Alte Oper Frankfurt with pianists Lucas and Arthur Jussen (December 12).  Robertson returns to the Czech Philharmonic (June 12-13) with works by Smetana, Beethoven and Stravinsky, and pianist Seong-Jin Cho.  In Asia, in March and April, David Robertson will return to the Hong Kong Philharmonic making his debut at the Hong Kong Arts Festival, Tongyeong International Music Festival in Korea, and to Kaohsiung for the Taiwan Festival.

Robertson appears with many major ensembles and festivals on five continents, including: the New York Philharmonic, The Philadelphia Orchestra, Los Angeles Philharmonic, Boston Symphony Orchestra, Chicago Symphony Orchestra, The Cleveland Orchestra, San Francisco Symphony, Dallas Symphony Orchestra, Houston Symphony, Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra, Milwaukee Symphony Orchestra, Utah Symphony, Toronto Symphony Orchestra, Orchestre symphonique de Montréal, Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra, Czech Philharmonic, Berliner Philharmoniker, Leipzig Gewandhausorchester, Wiener Philharmoniker, NDR Elbphilharmonieorcheste, Deutsches Symphonie-Orchester Berlin, the Symphonieorchester des Bayerischen Rundfunk, Staatskapelle Dresden, São Paulo State Symphony Orchestra, Sydney Symphony Orchestra, Seoul Philharmonic Orchestra, the New Japan Philharmonic, the China NCPA Orchestra, Taiwan National Symphony Orchestra; and at the Lucerne Festival, Berlin Festival, the Edinburgh Festival, the BBC Proms, Musica Viva Festival in Munich, the Aspen Music Festival and School, Music Academy of the West, Tongyeong International Music Festival, and Taiwan’s Kaohsiung Festival, among others.

David Robertson completed his transformative 13-year tenure as Music Director of the St. Louis Symphony Orchestra in 2018, where he solidified the orchestra’s status as one of the nation’s most enduring and innovative, and reinvigorated its American and European presence through regular touring programs.  For the SLSO, he created dynamic relationships with a wide spectrum of artists, and garnered a 2014 Grammy Award, Best Orchestral Performance, for the Nonesuch release of John Adams’ City Noir.  Among many other recordings, the historic Robertson-SLSO association, included the 2019 Blue Engine Records release of Wynton Marsalis’ Swing Symphony, with the Jazz at Lincoln Center Orchestra.  2019 was David Robertson’s valedictory season as Chief Conductor and Artistic Director of the Sydney Symphony Orchestra, the culmination of a six-year tenure leading the top orchestra of the Southern Hemisphere.

Building upon his prolific association with The Metropolitan Opera, Robertson conducted the encore performances in Fall 2021 of James Robinson’s lauded 2019 production of The Gershwins’ Porgy and Bess, which featured the returns of Eric Owens and Angel Blue in the lead roles.  Robertson’s musical leadership of the 2019-20 season Porgy and Bess production premiere was honored at the 63rd Grammy Awards, in March 2021, as Best Opera Recording.  Preceding this rich success, Robertson’s deep relationship with the Met Opera includes the premiere of Phelim McDermott’s celebrated 2018 production of Così fan tutte, set in 1950s Coney Island, and, since his Met debut in 1996 with The Makropulos Case, he has conducted a breathtaking range of Met projects, including the 2014 Met premiere of John Adams’ The Death of Klinghoffer; the 2016 revival of Janáček’s Jenůfa, then its first Met performances in nearly a decade; the premiere production of Nico Muhly’s Two Boys (2013); and many favorites, from Mozart’s Le Nozze di Figaro to Britten’s Billy Budd.  Robertson conducts projects at the world’s most prestigious opera houses, including La Scala, Théâtre du Châtelet, Bayerische Staatsoper (orchestra), the San Francisco Opera, and the Santa Fe Opera.  In January 2022, David Robertson made his debut with the Rome Opera conducting Janáček’s Káťa Kabanová to great critical acclaim.

In addition to Sydney and St. Louis, Robertson has served in artistic leadership positions at musical institutions including the Orchestre National de Lyon, and, as a protégé of Pierre Boulez, the Ensemble Intercontemporain, which he led on an extensive North American tour.  At the BBC Symphony Orchestra, he served as Principal Guest Conductor.  Robertson has served as a Perspectives Artist at Carnegie Hall, where he has conducted, among others, The Met Orchestra, Lucerne Festival Orchestra, St. Louis Symphony Orchestra, and The Juilliard Orchestra.

Robertson is the recipient of numerous musical and artistic awards, and in 2010 was made a Chevalier de l’Ordre des Arts et des Lettres by the Government of France.  In addition to his Juilliard roles, he is devoted to supporting young musicians and has worked with students at the festivals of Aspen, Tanglewood, Lucerne, at the Paris Conservatoire, Music Academy of the West, and the National Orchestra Institute.  In 2014, he led the Coast to Coast US tour of Carnegie Hall’s National Youth Orchestra of the USA.

Born in Santa Monica, California, David Robertson was educated at London’s Royal Academy of Music, where he studied horn and composition before turning to orchestral conducting.  He is married to pianist Orli Shaham, and lives in New York.